Re: When considering the alternatives-Induced demand?
Author: BOB2
Date: 12-14-2020 - 00:01

The assumption that additional capacity will create "induced demand", in congested urban areas with auto trips, or as a basis for rail extensions is largely a myth, as we see little travel "behavioral" evidence of a "Pfarfeggnuggin" effect. People make most trips to do things that add value to their lives within a finite real time/travel time "budget" within which to accomplish them.

What we sometimes see, which seems to "mimic" evidence of this claim of supposed "induced" demand, is that when we add a new travel "capacity" choice, it is usually to accommodate excess highly "suppressed" travel demands, in already severely congested locations with significant existing travel time delay. These "changes" in observed volumes, in a "new" corridor and/or modal alternative, are, most often, just a shift of existing trips to a more efficient choice. That is, a five hour LA-SD peak trip on I-5, versus 3 hours on LOSSAN, a 710 tunnel under South Pasadena, that "cuts" 20 miles off of a trip from La Canada to Orange County or South LA County, and saves 50 minutes of peak period "time" for the same trips. What people really do is shift from the longer route/mode to the shorter more "efficient" choice-they don't decide to make a "new" supposedly "induced" trim, because it is now more "fun" to drive.

I would suspect from the observed evidence in this case, that the primary reason for the "relatively" smaller rail passenger share, south of Portland, in the Willamette Valley, is: 1) that they are not as total travel time trip competitive, with a much more distributed (off line) population base, has not reached that point of time competitiveness with the current levels of urban/rural congestion on I-5, and 2), the comparatively poor service levels offered (wait time/transfer time/access time are known to have a higher "disutility" multiplier than "in-vehicle" travel times). As Bill Gates and his pal Steve Ballmer used to always say: "Faster, better, cheaper"... It is the same economic formula for serving travel demands, regardless of mode...



Subject Written By Date/Time (PST)
  A Cascadia bullet train: Time to move to next level or ‘kill this thing right now’? Sino mouse (aka Eric Swallowwell) 12-10-2020 - 21:25
  Cascadia rail funds Bezos & Gates, na. Not when you got S 12-11-2020 - 07:05
  Re: Cascadia rail funds got Stormy 12-11-2020 - 07:06
  Lib troll of many names, weirder than pdt? Stockton grade separation committee 12-11-2020 - 16:40
  Re: Lib troll of many names, weirder than pdt? uh oh, Michael Avenatti is a rail fan 12-11-2020 - 17:18
  Re: A Cascadia bullet train: Time to move to next level or ‘kill this thing right now’? FUD 12-11-2020 - 10:02
  Chinese Manufacturing LES 12-11-2020 - 10:20
  Re: Chinese Manufacturing Skeeter 12-11-2020 - 10:24
  Re: Chinese Manufacturing FUD 12-11-2020 - 22:40
  Re: Chinese Manufacturing LES 12-12-2020 - 03:29
  WSDOTs version LES 12-11-2020 - 10:05
  Re: WSDOTs version FUD 12-11-2020 - 10:28
  where ya going to build it reality check 12-11-2020 - 10:45
  A lot of time on Gates hands since he retired. LES 12-11-2020 - 11:33
  Re: A lot of time on Gates hands since he retired. reality check 12-12-2020 - 12:16
  Private contributions Commenter 12-11-2020 - 11:34
  Vote NO on another crazy train my 2 cents 12-11-2020 - 12:11
  Re: Vote NO on another crazy train my 2 cents 12-11-2020 - 12:29
  Re: Vote NO on another crazy train my 2 cents 12-11-2020 - 12:30
  Re: Vote NO on another crazy train LES 12-11-2020 - 12:37
  When considering the alternatives LES 12-11-2020 - 12:29
  Re: When considering the alternatives Erik H. 12-11-2020 - 17:36
  Re: When considering the alternatives You should do needs based planning. BOB2 12-11-2020 - 19:50
  Re: When considering the alternatives You should do needs based planning. LES 12-11-2020 - 20:54
  Re: When considering the alternatives You should do needs based planning. FUD 12-11-2020 - 22:30
  Re: When considering the alternatives You should do needs based planning. LES 12-12-2020 - 03:24
  Bill Gates reference LES 12-12-2020 - 04:29
  Re: When considering the alternatives You should do needs based planning. EU812 12-11-2020 - 22:41
  Re: When considering the alternatives You should do needs based planning. BOB2 12-12-2020 - 02:00
  Re: When considering the alternatives You should do needs based planning. LES 12-12-2020 - 03:41
  200 mph reference LES 12-12-2020 - 03:47
  Re: When considering the alternatives LES 12-11-2020 - 20:29
  Re: When considering the alternatives FUD 12-12-2020 - 06:36
  Re: When considering the alternatives LEL 12-12-2020 - 07:18
  Re: When considering the alternatives Erik H. 12-13-2020 - 21:41
  Re: When considering the alternatives-Induced demand? BOB2 12-14-2020 - 00:01
  Re: When considering the alternatives-Induced demand? FUD 12-14-2020 - 06:01


Go to: Message ListSearch
Subject: 
Your Name: 
Spam prevention:
Please, enter the code that you see below in the input field. This is for blocking bots that try to post this form automatically.
 ********  **     **  ********   *******    ******  
    **     ***   ***  **        **     **  **    ** 
    **     **** ****  **        **         **       
    **     ** *** **  ******    ********   **       
    **     **     **  **        **     **  **       
    **     **     **  **        **     **  **    ** 
    **     **     **  ********   *******    ******  
This message board is maintained by:Altamont Press
You can send us an email at altamontpress1@gmail.com