Re: San Bernardino (SP)
Author: Gary Hunter
Date: 11-27-2009 - 17:29

If my memory serves me well, I believe the depot on 3rd st. between E & F sts was shared by both SP and PE. I know for sure it was at least PE. As a kid, I remember seeing a small portion of the stub to the depot which came northward from Rialto Ave. still being used a a public team track. It was pruned back when the Berdoo depot became Greyhound and Metro Coach Lines only from around 1951. The PE main to Redlands used to come by one of two routes, one of which follwed Colton Ave, and was once a double track shared with SP, which continued past San Bernardino freight depot down Rialto Ave, and was the SP route to Redlands from about Arrowhead Ave east. The second route came via a different route that follwed La Cadena north from Colton on a NE diagonal route (was PE only), and turned straight north at Mt. Vernon and followed Mt. V north and made the sweeping turn east at 3rd and followed 3rd to the PE depot, and was joined with the track that came over from Rialto Ave (between E&F) in the middle of 3rd to continue down third to be joined a couple of blocks later by the Redlands main around the Arrowhead Puritas water bottling Co. This point, in the middle of 3rd between D and Arrowhead is where the E. Highlands line and the Arrowhead Springs branch split off. In 1943, PE passenger service to Riverside was discontinued and the numerous diamonds of the crossing of the SP main by the PE were removed. The Riverside branch was freight only after that and was accessed by SP from Colton to Riverside. Street running in Riverside remained until the late 1950s to access the remaining freith down to Corona. Somewhere around 1960, the PE got trackage rights on the ATSF from Riverside Jct, to May. The removal included all of the La Cadena PE trackage all the way past the ATSF and PE depots to the junction point with the Redlands main at roughly 3rd and D sts. I am not sure when the "back door" track to the PE depot was removed, but I don't remember seeing it at all in the 1950s. The PE trackage to Redlands (most of it) went away over the course of the 50s, but I have seen trolley ops caught on film in the 1951 farewell fantrips at the Sunkist plant on San Bernardino Ave (old Norton AFB.) Somehow, not well documented, the SP and PE branches were consolidated with the northern end being the SP, and some of the PE around Norton still being worked until nearly the 60s. Contrary to the memory of some, the trackage that went down Rialto Ave. East past the PE junction, was all SP, and I don't believe it was ever electrified, although it physicall resembled the PE by use of wig-wags and silver trimmed wood poles. One of the burning questions I have, is how long after WWII did SP continue to send steam on the San Berdoo? I actually had the good fortune to talk with an ATSF hogger in the 60s who worked the Redlands loop frequently in the 50s, and he told me of an incident where an SP 0-6-0 went into emergency because he was not paying good attention at the I st. interlocking and nearly hit the ATSF mid train (he said ATSF had the ROW on those). This was the first I had ever heard of steam on the PE. Since SP seemed to use steam everywhere up to the last minute, I wonder if steam was ever sent from Colton (along Colton Ave.) to the SP/PE yard any time in the 1950s. One of the other details I learned later in life was that SP had trackage rights on the PE almost everywhere from Claremont east. Bits and pieces of the severed PE, connected by bits and pieces of the SP branch lines in the area continued to operate to surpringly late dates in the 60s. The SP Palmdale cutoff project in 67 sealed the fate of the onetime Berdoo main of the PE (PE absorbed by SP in 65). Berdoo was acessed for a few more years from the Colton side after the Palmdale line severed it at "Bench". Not Bench by PE TTs, but close enough that it was chosen for the name of the junction when SP eventually made a connection to the cut off PE. There is not even a remnant of the old SP/PE 3rd st. depot. The whole street was razed for a mall project. Sorry for the long wind, but I love sharing what I remember of the post electric operations of the PE/SP around San Bernardino in the 1950s including the "water train" (Arrowhead Springs branch). I didn't realize how precious these memories would become.



Subject Written By Date/Time (PST)
  San Bernardino (SP) Sunset Express 11-27-2009 - 06:41
  Re: San Bernardino (SP) Charles Terrass 11-27-2009 - 07:52
  Re: San Bernardino (SP) Bill Root 11-27-2009 - 08:58
  Re: San Bernardino (SP) Mike Root 11-27-2009 - 13:41
  Re: San Bernardino (SP) Bill Root 11-27-2009 - 13:56
  Re: San Bernardino (SP) Mike Root 11-27-2009 - 14:19
  Re: San Bernardino (SP) Steven D. Johnson 11-27-2009 - 16:32
  Re: San Bernardino (SP) Gary Hunter 11-27-2009 - 17:29
  Re: San Bernardino (SP) SLOCONDR 11-27-2009 - 18:34
  Re: San Bernardino (SP) Rich Hunn 11-27-2009 - 19:28
  Re: San Bernardino (SP) Mike Root 11-27-2009 - 21:46
  Re: San Bernardino (SP) Steven D. Johnson 11-27-2009 - 22:12
  San Bernardino (UP??) unk diego 11-27-2009 - 22:54
  Re: San Bernardino (UP??) Mike Root 11-28-2009 - 07:53
  Re: San Bernardino (UP??) Bill Root 11-28-2009 - 08:33
  Re: San Bernardino (UP??) Mike 11-28-2009 - 11:23
  Re: San Bernardino (UP??) Bill Root 11-28-2009 - 12:03
  Re: San Bernardino (UP??) Rich Hunn 11-28-2009 - 13:39
  Re: San Bernardino (UP??) Gary Hunter 11-28-2009 - 14:24
  Re: San Bernardino (SP) Gary Hunter 11-28-2009 - 14:10
  Re: San Bernardino (SP) Gary Hunter 11-28-2009 - 14:00
  Re: San Bernardino (SP) Rich Hunn 11-28-2009 - 14:42
  Re: San Bernardino (SP) Gary Hunter 11-28-2009 - 15:42
  Re: San Bernardino (SP) Mike 11-28-2009 - 16:53
  Re: San Bernardino (SP) Rich Hunn 11-28-2009 - 19:21
  Re: San Bernardino (SP) Interurbans Special No. 61 Steven D. Johnson 11-28-2009 - 22:42
  Excerpt from Interurbans Special No. 61 Steven D. Johnson 11-28-2009 - 23:24
  Re: Excerpt from Interurbans Special No. 61 Gary Hunter 11-28-2009 - 23:59
  Re: San Bernardino (SP) Interurbans Special No. 61 Mike 11-29-2009 - 10:50
  Re: San Bernardino (SP) Gary Hunter 11-28-2009 - 23:40
  Re: San Bernardino (SP) Steven D. Johnson 11-29-2009 - 13:37
  Re: Arrowhead service- spoke too soon Steven D. Johnson 11-29-2009 - 16:03
  Re: Arrowhead service- spoke too soon Rich Hunn 11-29-2009 - 16:27


Go to: Message ListSearch
Subject: 
Your Name: 
Spam prevention:
Please, enter the code that you see below in the input field. This is for blocking bots that try to post this form automatically.
  *******    *******   **     **  **     **        ** 
 **     **  **     **  **     **  ***   ***        ** 
 **         **     **  **     **  **** ****        ** 
 ********    ********  **     **  ** *** **        ** 
 **     **         **  **     **  **     **  **    ** 
 **     **  **     **  **     **  **     **  **    ** 
  *******    *******    *******   **     **   ******  
This message board is maintained by:Altamont Press
You can send us an email at altamontpress1@gmail.com