Re: Metrolink blows another red
Author: Ray Eiser
Date: 12-04-2009 - 16:28

Again, No the CP "signals" on a dispatcher screen do not show the field signal aspects. As before all they show in the case of Digi-con and BNSF's TDMS is gray for non active signals, red for "stopped" signals in the reverse of routed active route, and green for the active route. Look up the NTSB's report on Chatsworth and look for the dispatcher displays for what a modern Digi-Con screen shows and what it looks like.

All a dispatcher "computer" provides the Control Points, Vital Logic, Programmable Logic Controller (PLC) is a clearance into and through the CP. The PLC then decides what aspects to display the CP's PLC will then "reply" with what is going on in and around the CP. Again the signals aspects are from the PLC not the dispatcher's "computer". So the rules are very clear that a dispatcher can not give a crew the color or the aspect of a signal as they has no idea even based on his "knowledge" of the tracks and territory. The CP's PLC use current sensing to confirm that a lamp they turn on is on or if it is burned out, and as above that is reported back to the dispatchers computer. So your "feedback" system already exists in some way, but it doesn't report the exact lamp(s) that is on or off. Current sensing is better then fiber optic light sense in that only current is considered and not light as you can get sunlight or other light into a signal in the right conditions. The new LED "Lamps" are causing a bit of trouble with the current sensing but is not a factor with this incident.

There's is a lot more going on but this a kinda thumb nail sketch on how it's been for years as all CTC is based of the clearance of signals only and the field does the vital logic of setting the aspects the signal display. The even can be cleared and still show stop if there's an occupancy on the cleared route. But the dispatcher's "computer" will not allow the clearing of the signals anyways.

To switch over to model railroads you've described system is similar to how most model railroad signaling controlling software works in that you do get all of the signal aspects on the "dispatchers" display. What's interesting is that you find it hard to fallow, and to me is a bit distracting and doesn't provide any useful information to the dispatcher, that's is also why it's not done on the real thing.

Besides, this incident and Chatsworth are unfortunately just human error and not the signal systems fault. Not to say the signal systems don't screw up from time to time but the system is set to go to the most restrictive aspect or state if that happens.

Ray Eiser



Subject Written By Date/Time (PST)
  Metrolink blows another red trainjunkie 12-02-2009 - 07:47
  Re: Metrolink blows another red K. C. Jones 12-02-2009 - 08:27
  Re: Metrolink blows another red trainjunkie 12-02-2009 - 09:02
  Well, If THAT'S The Way You Feel . . . K. C. Jones 12-02-2009 - 11:20
  Re: Well, If THAT'S The Way You Feel . . . trainjunkie 12-02-2009 - 11:26
  Re: Well, If THAT'S The Way You Feel . . . Jerry Garcia 12-02-2009 - 12:33
  Re: Well, If THAT'S The Way You Feel . . . Matt Farnsworth 12-02-2009 - 12:04
  Operator errors . 12-02-2009 - 12:51
  Re: Operator errors Tom McCann 12-02-2009 - 13:23
  Re: Operator errors Ex Passenger 12-02-2009 - 20:37
  Re: Operator errors jst3751 12-03-2009 - 09:56
  Re: Operator errors trolleyman 12-03-2009 - 13:33
  Re: Operator errors Ex Passenger 12-04-2009 - 00:24
  Re: Operator errors Ex Passenger 12-04-2009 - 00:46
  FRA = Friends of Railroad Administrators Eugene Salinsky 12-04-2009 - 05:42
  Re: FRA = Friends of Railroad Administrators J 12-04-2009 - 07:38
  Re: FRA = Friends of Railroad Administrators Dr Zarkoff 12-04-2009 - 17:02
  Re: FRA = Friends of Railroad Administrators Ex Passenger 12-04-2009 - 19:31
  Re: Metrolink blows another red Gary Hunter 12-04-2009 - 11:48
  Re: Metrolink blows another red J 12-04-2009 - 12:03
  Re: Metrolink blows another red theconductor 12-04-2009 - 12:09
  time to hear from the Old Pole Burner The Montezuma Yardmaster 12-04-2009 - 12:54
  Re: Metrolink blows another red Gary Hunter 12-04-2009 - 14:03
  Re: Metrolink blows another red theconductor 12-04-2009 - 16:24
  Re: Metrolink blows another red Ray Eiser 12-04-2009 - 16:28
  Re: Metrolink blows another red mook 12-04-2009 - 17:01
  Re: Metrolink blows another red Ex Passenger 12-04-2009 - 20:47
  Re: Metrolink blows another red Dr Zarkoff 12-06-2009 - 11:25
  Re: Metrolink blows another red Dr Zarkoff 12-04-2009 - 17:26
  Q. How Much Productivity Can You Wring Out Of An Employee? Peter Warner 12-05-2009 - 23:07


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