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So ur justification for 1.3 miles @ $8 bil is a whataboutism of the worst hiway cost overrun boondoggle in US history? That is still way cheaper per mile and user
Author: Bold move, Cotton
Date: 03-29-2024 - 15:57
"How expensive was the “Big Dig”? According to local sources like Boston's WBUR, the total cost for the “Big Dig” was an estimated $24.3 billion."
LOL. The Big Dig is not just the central tunnel under Boston. Which would be most comparable to a Caltrain-HSR tunnel to SFTC. But it also included 2 river bridges, the I90 tunnel under the harbor to the airport and several interchanges. All sources I've seen put the Big Dig at 21 to 22 billion in today's dollars, but I'll go with your inflated figure of 24. At 8 miles of new roadway that's $3 billion per mile. For the most criticized, worst example of highway cost inflation in the US. Congrats. The SF rail boondoggle of 1.3 miles for $8 billion you're defending is more than twice as expensive per mile.
But it would serve a fraction of the amount of users of the Big Dig. In 2019 the Caltrain San Fran station served 30k riders on a middle of the week day. I'm sure you'll comeback with an inflated unicorn projection for riders if we just build this "missing link." But it won't even double. I couldn't quickly find CAHSR's (inflated to justify) rider estimates for SF itself, but they now project 28.4 million per year (about 80k per day) systemwide after buildout. That's all travel route pairs, so 40k per day at SF station only is at the high end. I'll be generous and say 60 + 40 = 100k per day. That's $80,000 per daily user. (Although the real question would be how many new users that otherwise wouldn't take rail if it terminated at the existing station.)
Just the Tip O'Neill and I90 tunnels carry over 250k vehicles a day and other interchange segments of the Big Dig carry even more (estimates of over 500k individuals per day.) Staying conservative at 250k vehicles x the standard average of 1.5 persons per vehicle = 375k per day. which severely undercounts the 39k per day Silver Line bus ridership via I90 to Logan Airport so I'll adjust to 400k per day.
The highway will have at least 4 times as many users as this rail extension.
24 bil at 400k user per day = $60,000 per daily user.
So congrats, the proposed rail fiasco you are promoting is more expensive in both per mile and per user than even the worst cost overrun highway boondoggle in US history.
"What a bargain!" as Eddie Murphy used to say.
LOL. The Big Dig is not just the central tunnel under Boston. Which would be most comparable to a Caltrain-HSR tunnel to SFTC. But it also included 2 river bridges, the I90 tunnel under the harbor to the airport and several interchanges. All sources I've seen put the Big Dig at 21 to 22 billion in today's dollars, but I'll go with your inflated figure of 24. At 8 miles of new roadway that's $3 billion per mile. For the most criticized, worst example of highway cost inflation in the US. Congrats. The SF rail boondoggle of 1.3 miles for $8 billion you're defending is more than twice as expensive per mile.
But it would serve a fraction of the amount of users of the Big Dig. In 2019 the Caltrain San Fran station served 30k riders on a middle of the week day. I'm sure you'll comeback with an inflated unicorn projection for riders if we just build this "missing link." But it won't even double. I couldn't quickly find CAHSR's (inflated to justify) rider estimates for SF itself, but they now project 28.4 million per year (about 80k per day) systemwide after buildout. That's all travel route pairs, so 40k per day at SF station only is at the high end. I'll be generous and say 60 + 40 = 100k per day. That's $80,000 per daily user. (Although the real question would be how many new users that otherwise wouldn't take rail if it terminated at the existing station.)
Just the Tip O'Neill and I90 tunnels carry over 250k vehicles a day and other interchange segments of the Big Dig carry even more (estimates of over 500k individuals per day.) Staying conservative at 250k vehicles x the standard average of 1.5 persons per vehicle = 375k per day. which severely undercounts the 39k per day Silver Line bus ridership via I90 to Logan Airport so I'll adjust to 400k per day.
The highway will have at least 4 times as many users as this rail extension.
24 bil at 400k user per day = $60,000 per daily user.
So congrats, the proposed rail fiasco you are promoting is more expensive in both per mile and per user than even the worst cost overrun highway boondoggle in US history.
"What a bargain!" as Eddie Murphy used to say.
| Subject | Written By | Date/Time (PST) |
|---|---|---|
 "Congress can curtail expensive California transit projects"
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Commenter | 03-28-2024 - 14:18 |
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Re: "Congress can curtail expensive California transit projects"
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Clem | 03-28-2024 - 19:42 |
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Wait, you really are mad that someone opposes spending $8 billion for a 1.3 mile tunnel in SF?
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Back in the real world | 03-28-2024 - 20:29 |
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But you need a highway to spend real money.
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Commenter | 03-29-2024 - 11:19 |
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Re: But you need a highway to spend real money.
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FUD | 03-29-2024 - 11:56 |
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So ur justification for 1.3 miles @ $8 bil is a whataboutism of the worst hiway cost overrun boondoggle in US history? That is still way cheaper per mile and user |
Bold move, Cotton | 03-29-2024 - 15:57 |