You don't want anyone to shout over you - Fair enough.

But then - don't shout over them!

It was that shouting at Smitty that brought me into this thread in the first place!

As to someone considering another person's religion a "Cult" - that is just pure bigotry, plain and simple. It hardly constitutes a proper definition as to what is Christian and what is not.

As to the alleged Christianity of this nation, or that of the founding Fathers. Whether or not some narrow minded Christian or narrow mined non-Christian (they both exist) think of someone's religion as christian or not, is not particularly important to me. Nor does their thinking of it make it so.

Thomas Jefferson himself wrote that he believed none of the then existing churches were in fact the original church that Christ created. He was in fact very concerned about that huge discrepancy; he and millions of Americans along with him. It mattered to them that Christ's church did not seem to them) to actually still exist. That does not make them non-Christian.

So he acted and associated himself accordingly - as any decent God fearing man would. He later described himself as a Deist, (note that this Deism bears little resemblance to those religions of today who claim deist roots). Did he ever write of doubting Christ's divinity; or the existence of that same God that Christians claimed to worship? Half of the churches who today claim to be Christian - do that now. So questioning doesn't make them non-christian either - it would seem.

I personally cannot see anything that is un-Christian in any of his religious writings at all; though some people do take a much narrower view of Christianity than I do. Questioning and searching for the real truth only makes you better at it - in my view. But mostly, the Founding Father's own writings constantly make references to "Deity", and "Divine Providence". Even the Constitution requires that a "Congressional Chaplain" be appointed. Such references are everywhere.

Actually, people of many sects (most avowedly Christian) were deeply involved in the formation of this strange new notion of personal liberty. At the time, that notion existed nowhere else - though it did anciently. Consequently, Christians were also deeply involved in the formation of this nation. But of every strip and belief, they all managed to unify in a great common cause - Religious Liberty.

And that is the great miracle of it all. That is enough for me. To claim that this nation could ever have been formed, except for the teachings of liberty and personal responsibility found in the highest of Christian ethics, is stretching it way too thin.

And that does not detract one bit from the fine ethics to be found in other religions - its just that by some twist of fate or other, they mostly were not here at the time. Various Christian sects were - and it did happen, the cause and effect being plain and obvious.