Re: Crash at Portola?
Author: SP5103
Date: 08-06-2011 - 07:48

I agree with your explanation of restricted speed, but your application and comments regarding yard limits are wrong. (I assume you have never been quaified by a railroad on the rules?)

> Rule 6.13 about yard limits should also be
> reviewed especially the part which reads, "...All
> movements entering or moving within yard limits
> must be made at restricted speed unless operating
> under a block signal indication that is more
> favorable than Approach." I doubt that any part
> of the Museum's trackage is outside yard limits,
> and therefore all movements must be made at
> restricted speed.


Actually all the museum's trackage would NOT be in yard limits.


6.13 Yard Limits
Within yard limits, trains or engines are authorized to use the main tracknot protecting against other trains or engines, only after obtaining a track warrant, listing all track bulletins that affect their movement.
Engines must give way as soon as possible to trains as they approach. Engines must keep posted as to the arrival of passenger trains and must not delay them.
All movements entering or moving within yard limits must be made at restricted speed unless operating under a block signal indication that is more favorable than Approach.
Upon observing or having advance knowledge that a block signal may require restricted speed due to yard limits, if entering or within yard limits, the movement must be at restricted speed at that block signal, or as soon as possible thereafter, consistent with good train handling.
Yard limits remain in effect continuously unless otherwise specified by special instructions or track bulletin.

Main Track (GCOR glossary)
A track extending through yards and between stations that must not be occupied without authority or protection.

The Portola museum might have designated their turning loop as main track, but a main track has many different rules (authority to occupy which might be in yard limits, normal position of switches, not delaying passenger trains not leaving blocked, etc.) TRacks in a yard are not in yard limits unless they are desingated as a main track, everything else falls under 6.28 (except for sidings and diamonds which have their own specific rules.)

6.28 Movement on Other than Main Track
Except when moving on a main track or on a track where a block system is in effect, trains or engines must move at a speed that allows them to stop within half the range of vision short of:
• Train.
• Engine.
• Railroad car.
• Men or equipment fouling the track.
• Stop signal.
or
• Derail or switch lined improperly.

Notice that 6.28 does not require restricted speed, but the definitions are similar except for looking out for broken rail and not to exceed 20 mph. There were some railroads that claimed you could run a branch under this rule at any speed you wanted, but I believe the FRA since has required some kind of authority or signal indication to operate above 20 mph.

This assumes that the Portola museum is operating under the current GCOR or a simplified version of it. I would guess they are an insular operation not under the jurisdiction of the FRA. When they do operate off property, the crew is usually members who are qualified UP employees.

Per Portola's 1993 rule book:

The utmost care and diligence must be used in the maintenance and handling of museum equipment, due to its unique nature, age and historical significance.

93. Within yard limits, trains and engines may use track without train order authority and will not exceed restricted speed.

99. When a train is moving under circumstances where it might be overtaken by another train, flagman must take action necessary to ensure protection.
The front of the train must be protected in the same way, if necessary, by the brakeman or by the fireman if brakeman is not available.
Conductors and Engineers are responsible for the protection of their trains or engines.

HERDER: A person responsible for lining switches, not a member of the train crew.

RESTRICTED SPEED: A speed that will permit stopping within ½ the range of vision short of train, engine, on track equipment, railroad car, stop signal, derail or switch not properly lined, looking out for broken rail, not exceeding ten (10) miles per hour.

Per their 1993 operating rules, they apparently considered all tracks are "yard limits" but do not clearly define them as such, nor do they mention a main track. Without a copy of Portola's rules, general orders and timetable in effect at the time, what rules were actually violated is pure speculation.

What is clear is that it should not have happened - period.



Subject Written By Date/Time (PST)
  Crash at Portola? Claims Agent 08-05-2011 - 00:37
  Re: Crash at Portola? Rid 08-05-2011 - 10:12
  WP 917 Eugene 08-05-2011 - 10:26
  Re: WP 917 Rid 08-06-2011 - 11:02
  Re: Crash at Portola? Ooooops 08-05-2011 - 10:28
  Re: Crash at Portola? njt 08-05-2011 - 11:01
  Re: Crash at Portola? Ooooooops 08-05-2011 - 11:18
  Cause Eugene 08-05-2011 - 11:43
  Re: Crash at Portola? Restricted Speed 08-06-2011 - 02:45
  Re: Crash at Portola? SP5103 08-06-2011 - 07:48
  Re: Crash at Portola? Restricted Speed 08-24-2011 - 23:50
  Re: Crash at Portola? Oldie 08-05-2011 - 17:48
  Re: Crash at Portola? Fred 08-05-2011 - 19:37
  Re: Crash at Portola? Claims Agent 08-05-2011 - 22:08
  Re: Crash at Portola? Tom Carter - Director - FRRS 08-06-2011 - 22:24
  Re: Crash at Portola? OPRRMS 08-06-2011 - 23:17
  Re: Crash at Portola? Tippy 08-07-2011 - 10:29
  Re: Crash at Portola? Topper 08-07-2011 - 10:31
  Re: Crash at Portola? Major English 08-09-2011 - 03:33
  Re: Crash at Portola? Stickler 08-09-2011 - 09:21
  Re: Crash at Portola? Tom 08-05-2011 - 23:42
  Re: Crash at Portola? Shortline Sammie 08-06-2011 - 07:38
  Re: Crash at Portola? OPRRMS 08-06-2011 - 12:23
  Re: Crash at Portola? Ghosts of Incidents Past 08-06-2011 - 12:54
  Re: Crash at Portola? Reader 08-06-2011 - 13:04
  Re: Crash at Portola? teo 08-07-2011 - 09:53
  Re: Crash at Portola? FresnoSub 08-07-2011 - 12:29
  Re: Crash at Portola? Tom 08-07-2011 - 12:29
  Re: Crash at Portola? OPRRMS 08-07-2011 - 12:50
  Re: Crash at Portola? Dr Zarkoff 08-07-2011 - 23:24
  Re: Crash at Portola? SP5103 08-07-2011 - 15:45
  Re: Crash at Portola? Don't Ask Don't Tell 08-07-2011 - 16:25
  Re: Crash at Portola? Tipo 08-07-2011 - 17:42
  Re: Crash at Portola? eo 08-07-2011 - 17:45
  Re: Crash at Portola? M. Harris 08-07-2011 - 17:55
  Re: Crash at Portola? Shortline Sammie 08-07-2011 - 19:55
  Re: Crash at Portola? Observer 08-07-2011 - 21:05
  Re: Crash at Portola? FresnoSub 08-08-2011 - 08:45
  Re: Crash at Portola? Dr Zarkoff 08-08-2011 - 09:45
  Re: Crash at Portola? topper 08-08-2011 - 10:58
  Clearing up a few things Eugene 08-08-2011 - 11:35
  Re: Clearing up a few things Link 08-08-2011 - 12:11
  Re: Thanks Eugene Tom Moungovan 08-08-2011 - 12:47
  Re: Thanks Eugene George Andrews 08-08-2011 - 20:43
  Re: Thanks Eugene Mike Lepker 08-21-2011 - 20:30
  Re: Thanks Eugene OPRRMS 08-22-2011 - 14:07
  Re: Thanks Eugene Glen Icanberry 08-24-2011 - 22:56


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