 |
Re: We Need to Electrify As Much Transportation As We Can
Author: mook
Date: 04-04-2016 - 20:57
SF Muni's hydro power comes from Hetch Hetchy. Yes, it does cover much of the power used, but it's not limitless; in fact, I wouldn't be surprised if the available Hetch Hetchy power in an average year (let alone a drought year) is more than used up by the current Muni and other SF municipal uses. That said, there are other reasons to do trolley buses; it's just that most of those reasons have already been addressed.
Trolley buses can climb hills better than most diesels. That's why the 24 line (among others) converted from diesel to trolley (back in the 1980s, I think). Had nothing to do with emissions - it was simply to operate the line properly on the hills. In diesel days with the Macks the 24 and a few other lines were laughable - either they had to use buses with special granny gearing (and a top speed of 25-30 mph) or the passengers sometimes had to get off and walk up the hill to meet the bus (which could barely haul its own weight up the hill) and get back on. Those screaming loud mid-60s GMs were specified that way in an effort to handle any route - they had V8 power and both a granny low and a freeway high (3-speed transmission instead of 2) to both climb the hills and do the 30 Express, at the expense of the hearing of everybody in town. Once the GMs were replaced with more modern (and underpowered) diesels, the need for the trolley buses came back.
Trolley buses as used in SF don't need a top speed of more than 30-35 mph. They would need more than that on Geary unless relegated only to the stop-every-block local - hardly worth spending the pile of $$ that adding wires would require. Diesels would still be needed to handle the limiteds, expresses, and trippers. So I don't see where adding wires to the 38, which has little in the way of hills, would help much.
LA once had trolley buses too. They died at about the same time as the last of the streetcars and PE lines. Note that LA does not and did not have municipal power largely from hydro plants, like SF. Some, yes, but LADWP always had thermal plants (burning various things) to cover most of their load, which included (and still does) most residents of LA. So one would expect electric transit of any type to be more expensive to run there than in SF - the "fuel" isn't nearly free.
Trolley buses can climb hills better than most diesels. That's why the 24 line (among others) converted from diesel to trolley (back in the 1980s, I think). Had nothing to do with emissions - it was simply to operate the line properly on the hills. In diesel days with the Macks the 24 and a few other lines were laughable - either they had to use buses with special granny gearing (and a top speed of 25-30 mph) or the passengers sometimes had to get off and walk up the hill to meet the bus (which could barely haul its own weight up the hill) and get back on. Those screaming loud mid-60s GMs were specified that way in an effort to handle any route - they had V8 power and both a granny low and a freeway high (3-speed transmission instead of 2) to both climb the hills and do the 30 Express, at the expense of the hearing of everybody in town. Once the GMs were replaced with more modern (and underpowered) diesels, the need for the trolley buses came back.
Trolley buses as used in SF don't need a top speed of more than 30-35 mph. They would need more than that on Geary unless relegated only to the stop-every-block local - hardly worth spending the pile of $$ that adding wires would require. Diesels would still be needed to handle the limiteds, expresses, and trippers. So I don't see where adding wires to the 38, which has little in the way of hills, would help much.
LA once had trolley buses too. They died at about the same time as the last of the streetcars and PE lines. Note that LA does not and did not have municipal power largely from hydro plants, like SF. Some, yes, but LADWP always had thermal plants (burning various things) to cover most of their load, which included (and still does) most residents of LA. So one would expect electric transit of any type to be more expensive to run there than in SF - the "fuel" isn't nearly free.
